TrueTomHarley

If @JW Insider didn't have to keep messing with 607 BCE, they probably wouldn't have to rewrite anything!

There was a study - it was not specifically about Witnesses - that concluded the topic studied has much to do with whether students leave the religion of their youth or not. Students in business and engineering do it less. If you combine that with a scenario where you are living at home and not on campus.... If you combine that with a scenario where you do not take on massive debt, thus ensuring you will HAVE to work full time for many years to come, then you maximize your chances of coming out with a net gain. On the other hand, many courses of study amount to little more than unscrewing your head and inviting someone to pour in all the ideas that Paul dismissed as refuse.

This comment, as usual, has nothing to do with anything and is just you building a platform on which to bellow. I never said college was worthless. I said a day of divine education is worth 1000 years of it.

They routinely say in publications: 'At that time we thought this' or 'this view was held at that time' or something similar. They make no secret - in fact, they advertise - that things have changed. I think it is less of an enemy than you think. Back in the day, I worked at the food counter, when they used to serve the pre-packaged items at assemblies. One of the items was a 'pasta salad.' You would say that so and so ordered 'a pasta salad.' In time, I could not resist calling them 'apostacy salads.'

This also is nonsense, like most of what you say, and it also betrays a basic misunderstanding of people and how they are motivated. The ones with income and power tell the others what to do and they do it. That's how the chief priests stirred up the common people to demand Jesus' death - people who had kind of liked him. It is like the verse says in the JTR translation: "If they have hated me, they will nevertheless love you, unless there is drivel from the GB."

What in the world was wrong with that crazy person?

This is nonsense and it betrays a basic misunderstanding of people and their motivations. The truth was bitterly resisted long before any 'drivel' came along.

Seven years ago an evangelical preacher researched and published the truth about the cross. It was a sensation. ABC went on and on about the article. If Jehovah's Witnesses had said it (as they have) the article would not line the bottom of their birdcage. It matters little what is said - what matters is who says it. http://www.tomsheepandgoats.com/2010/11/did-jesus-die-on-a-cross.html When I mentioned this to Brother Madonia from the old country, he exclaimed: "Onomatopoeia!"

If someone from the 1950's was resurrected and began to complain how science had taken advantage of him - depriving him of a flat screen color TV whereas it hypocritically bestowed them upon later generations, would you say he had a valid point? Time marches on. New things come to light. Positions evolve. It happens everywhere. It is not a plot to work you over.

The annual meeting entertained briefly the notion that angels, too, may have played a role in the building - I think they said in legal and safety issues, for example. That was a novel thought - angels participating! With only minor imagination, one can imagine the following heavenly scene, in the spirit of that conference to fool Ahab: Brother Wingedwarrior strode into the room and asked for his daily assignment. The other angels looked strangely relieved, but the one in charge looked sheepish. Finally, he said: "Brother, your assignment today is to monitor @James Thomas Rook Jr." (give me artistic licence here. I admit this is a stretch) "Aw, C'mon!!" Wingedwarrior cried in disgust, throwing his clipboard on the table so violently that it spilled the coffee urn, splashing angels nearby, even soaking their wings, which are not supposed to get wet. It was an accident, but since angels are perfect, several in the room looked at him suspiciously. "Why me? You guys have it in for me!" "Look, brother, you know how it is. We drew lots. It fell on you." "Well, it's a dumb system, anyway, named after some loser who didn't know enough to get out of Gay City! I'm not going to let it dictate my life!" "See here, Brother WW, we all must make sacrifices. Of course, you'd rather work with someone appreciative - we all would - but many assignments in God's service are lowly - and some are downright disgusting. As you know, James bought that huge warehouse in Mt. Moron, New York, and he has converted it into a graphics studio. We hear he plans 400 releases in the upcoming year. Someone has to watch him. Just look at the idiot stuff he has displayed. It's hard to believe he is an adult: "Think of the love you'll be showing to God. Think of the love for your brothers. Think of the love for those creatures below whom the Word likes," the head angel continued smoothly. If they lay the 'love' stuff on long enough, they can get you to do anything. At last, Brother WW grumbled: "Alright, alright, I'll do it. Where is a hard hat?" "Ha ha! Brother WW, you are too funny. We are spirit creatures and we have no need of har..." "LOOK, YOU ASSIGNED ME TO MONITOR JTR!!!! NOW, WHERE IS A HARDHAT?!!!!" For one brief moment, the head angel seemed taken aback. Presently he murmured: "We'll look about. They may be one kicking around here somewhere."

I think you interpret holding a different opinion as yourself as being 'brainwashed. At 2/2 with total 4 hours per week, all the rest of the time carrying on as normal? You're joking! Yes. If you claim you were brainwashed at only 4 hours per week, you only testify to how stupid and helpless you think you are. Why not just say you changed your mind, reassessed your goals? I have done that. Everyone has. People change their minds. There is no shame in saying that. But if you carry on that the only reason you could have reversed a decision you made is that you were brainwashed - surely that is pathetic. Look, I didn't say they were brainwashed in college. I said college splendidly meets one classic criteria of brainwashing: separate the victim from all that is familiar. Ones who later come to regret their college time seldom say they are brainwashed, despite that 24/7 criteria. How much more ridiculous to say it happened with 4 hours per week.

Tacking on a 30 minute commute both ways, twice a week, is not nothing. I don't want to blow it off as though it were. There are no examples of great inconvenience in our circuit, but that is not to say it is not so elsewhere. Nor will I pretend that even loyal ones may not grouse a bit, even as they understand the overall benefit. Of course, disloyal ones will bellow till the cows come home, but even loyal ones may not turn on a dime. One of the reasons Jehovah's organization works and others do not - and least not on such a scale - is that Witnesses have come to love the entire brotherhood, regardless of where in the world they may live, and do not obsess about their own immediate interests. They don't all figure they have to all go over to Benin and see for themselves and each ponder over the balance statement and have special sessions to discuss it and take a vote on it because no one other than themselves can be trusted - they just don't. They've decided the ones having oversight are trustworthy - they've given no cause to think otherwise, as they adhere to the same healthful scriptural teachings - so they grin and bear it if some policy does not work to their immediate benefit.

You are indeed an unusual person.

You're right. They would have evaporated as a religon rather than go to the government and fill out some forms.

The rules are doubtless different in each country and I am not everywhere. I speak of the U.S.

Of course. This is a no-brainer. You ought not carry on as though it were evil. Nor should you carry on about it being a 'corporation.' It is only a corporation because the laws of this world will not let you operate otherwise. Even the old individual halls were usually 'corporations' - as are church bodies - because that is the only way legally permitted for a group to own property. Even the 'apostles and old men' of the first century would have organized themselves as a corporation if that were a necessity to legally operate. This is a big 'Duh' and for you and yours carry on as though you've discovered the secrets of the dark side is a bit much.

Well, proceeds from selling an underused building have built half the Kingdom Halls in Benin.* Surely that is worth something. They get fed. And they will appreciate it, having long done without. Are they not also the flock? *Not literally. Don't go off on this.

No. It has been established Witnesses don't do it. What more 'information' can be said? They either do it or they don't do it. Visit a Hall to see that they don't do it. However, I do have information on better economic use of Kingdom Halls, which you also brought up. Historically, Witnesses living in different areas struck out from the main Kingdom Hall to build one of their own, in their own communities. Over time, some of these Halls became overcrowded and some dwindled into under-use. What a responsible use of resources - @James Thomas Rook Jr. will agree with me on this, for he is not a selfish person who thinks only of himself - to consolidate where need be, even to shut 'underperforming' buildings - so that the good of the worldwide congregation of God is realized, even if it means a longer twice-a-week commute for some who lovingly acquiesce to this financially responsible direction. After all, shut down one dog of a Kingdom Hall in a US area that has not filled it, and you can build 20 in poorer nations that greatly need them. How loving is that?

Imagine - calling the other guy Rocketman at the U.N. and getting the whole world to join in the refrain. How can you not give a thumbs-up when a guy does that? And then some kid comes along and photoshops an Elton John concert playing that very song, replacing John's head with Kim's, and inserts the huge video screen backdrop of North Korean rockets wheeling about, the shrill newscaster shrieking, the troops goosestepping - how do you expect any guy with a sense of humor to hold it together? It is as Paul said - the world is a theater. The only thing that might check your hilarity briefly is the unpleasant thought that a misstep, for starters, will result in half the planet up in smoke. But that is small potatoes. Is it reckless? Tillerson certainly seems the more stable of the two, doesn't he? Unless they are both playing good cop/bad cop. And, to be fair, while everyone hopes for diplomacy, the diplomacy that has led straight up to the present situation and will presumably lead up to one where North Korean missiles are parked on your toes, should at least be mentioned as having worked out not that splendidly. Isn't there a Neville someone-or-other who favored negotiations back during another evil time? Or do I misunderstand even that? The trouble with history is that whenever you think you have something figured out, along comes someone from a different perspective to upend all your notions. Meanwhile, it was Putin - mean, nasty, Chief Officer of Evil, His Wickedness, 'murderer and a thug' Putin - all that remains in the West is to photoshop him with Devil's horns, grinning ear-to-ear at his laptop as he hacks US elections - who supplied a key bit of understanding when he visited China. Sanctions will never work on North Korea, he said - Kim will see every single one of his people starved to death before he will give up on his nukes. Why? Because he knows about Libya and Iraq. Though Saddam swore up and down he had no weapons of mass destruction - which turned out to be exactly correct - that did not stop his enemies from taking him out and killing a family member or two in the process. Look, he is not my friend - Putin. I mean, he hasn't exactly been nice to my people, Jehovah's Witnesses, lately, has he? But give credit where credit is due. He nailed it. Tellingly, when CNBC or someone covered that Chinese meeting - if Putin so much as tied his shoe there, they reported it - they covered every detail EXCEPT his statement about Saddam, thus allowing perception to stand in the US that Kim is completely unhinged - a perception he does nothing to clear up by his own pontifications - listening to him is not exactly like listening to John Tesh, is it? Jehovah's Witnesses are neutral in the world's affairs for noble reasons - it is not God's idea for the world to be carved up into scores of squabbling factions ever playing 'King-of-the-Mountain" and he will soon act to bring about his own kingdom replacement. However, another reason to be neutral - albeit a less noble one - is that it is almost impossible to get the truth on anything - you are forever acting in the dark - for every outlet spins 'truth' their own way according to their own agenda. Even Western media condemnation about calling Kim Rocketman must be weighed against their approval of calling Putin a murderer and a thug, a Senator's description that they picked up on and used freely. Is it wise to taunt him like that? Whenever in my house-to-house ministry I spot a murderer and a thug, I cross over to the other side of the street.

I've said it. "What do you say?" "I've said it." "Do you have any more?" 'Howoooooooooooooooooooo!!!!! ... Hey Bulldog, the Beatles

I'm not sure exactly what you posted or if it means that I owe you an apology, but if it does, then I do. It was the other fellow I was speaking to mostly - I just brought you in for the purpose of background serenade.

I was being charitable and allowing the silly stuff you brought up to be included as 'evidence.'

Somewhere there is someone saying "how long must I put up with you?' Sigh....I mean, C'mon! Are there no limits? In their overall picture, the videos represent one tenth of one percent of their output, if that. And they are shown infrequently. The people who have undertaken to do the task his word assigns to them, of Matt 24:14. Witnesses can look around everywhere and see that the money they donate is being put to good use. A suggestion is not a requirement. And even that is an aggregate amount per congregation - not per person. We have covered this. Why do you carry on as though we haven't? A suggestion is not a requirement. Look, if you hate the message, you will hate the messenger. That is a valid position - to hate the message. Just be upfront about it, would you please?

I'm sure there is. Whenever I am stuck, I also reach for some highbrow perch from where I can sneer at ones who have not yielded. I wonder too, at how they cope with their 'cognitive dissonance,' - as in: "Surely your cognitive dissonance must be crippling you if you can withstand the brute force of my brilliant reasoning!" No, @Shiwiii, your point, which you have repackaged endlessly for re-submission each time you see it shot down, is not valid. It is juvenile. Nobody is less intrusive than Jehovah's Witnesses when it comes to money matters.

Actually, this is sillier and more irresponsible than most of what you have said. Whatever 'killing' there is to be is not by human hands and Witnesses seek to align themselves with the safer side - that's all - and to represent that side with words only. Since the days of Jesus no Witness has resorted to physical weapons and your newfound friend @James Thomas Rook Jr. has even rebuked us for that, (in a thread that was before you came around) saying a real man should always be armed. The best answer is given by my daughter, someone who was primarily trained by .....well...you know.....but her answer reflects that of most Witnesses when pressed. When a person pressed her on just who would be saved and who not, she replied: "Well, I'm not Jesus, and I don't know." You get as close as you can to the place of safety. How far away can you be? A certain distance, or not one inch? That is what most Witnesses do not pretend to know.