TrueTomHarley

Okay. I'll let it go.To be sure, when I get something in my head, I do obsess about it. Truce for now. But tomorrow it may not be that way.

Nor did I name anyone here, which was deliberate. Some will recogniize things straight off, but at least if anyone new should come along, they will not think I am delieberately going after anyone. They may reassess that opinion  soon, but they will have to do research to uncover exactly who's who, and most people are not into it that much.

What I am obsessing about at the moment is my encounter with a thorn bush which is prompting the soul-searching thought: "With all the fine instruction you receive at the Kingdom Hall, TrueTom, it would be nice if you applied it, rather than viewing certain occasions as splendid opportunities to display your linguistic skills. You can always get a new ear in the resurrection."

3 hours ago, Ann O'Maly said:

If anyone cares enough to know what 'shoving match' TTH keeps harping on about, it's on this thread.

 

It was a very long thread, too.

To say 'harping' is unkind. I don't dare do it, lest Ann or someone complains.

For some time, i'd been wanting the run the 'Jehovah Will Treat His Loyal One in a Special Way' video past someone impartial to see if it would affect them as it does me. I settled upon an atheist kid - a kid only from my point of view, not one in reality, since anyone 30 years younger than I is a kid.

I liked him from the moment someone brought me along as backup after he had agreed to a return call. Did he think I was one of the top guns that had been summoned? Not sure what he was getting into, tactfully trying to set some ground rules, he probed: "I just want to make sure....if I should ask you to leave, you will leave, right?"

"You'll be lucky to get rid of us by midnight," I said, but then asked him how much time he had in mind. It was more than we would have presumed in the first place. 

So on the followup call, having a feel for the kid, I told him I wanted to do an experiment. I told him the video I wanted to show him was not preachy; in fact, there were no words. He would not understand much of it, I said, but not to worry. it was not a trap, and there would be no test at the end. As I had hoped, he was more than willing. He was eager for the challenge. He was a heady, curious guy and I figured he would be into that kind of thing. After watching the video I asked him to suggest a storyline for it, and that really sent him into overdrive.

Though I did it as much out of personal curiosity than an attempt to witness, clearly it works for the latter with a certain type of person - you couldn't just randomly show it at doors.

The weak link in this approach was something I had only vaguely suspected. It was ME. It was hard for me to stay dry-eyed watching it, and nearly impossible to do so explaining it. Did I make a fool of myself? Or might it have been an additional draw for him - to see how certain scenes and footage could reach the heart. After all, everyone knows how a Hollywood production can tug at the heart, though the storyline be pure fiction.

To be moved in such a way is for me not such a bad thing, and perhaps it is personal growth. I have never been one to wear my heart on my sleeve and I almost look forward to people dying so that I can give the funeral talk.

You are not the villain. If you initially raised the subject, someone else picked it up and it is with her, not you, that there was a shoving match.

The other video is made by the Barbara Sinatra foundation. It is well done. But it is not foolproof.

There sits happily on its own thread what is essentially a shoving match over whose child porn video is better. It could be allowed to stay there, but as with Ephesians 1, it is good to gather all things together. Plus, I've turned it over in my head and have some new ideas.

Our video is no good, says one villain, because pedophilia is there portrayed as a dark monster. She is unimpressed that Caleb and Sophia are told to immediately run and tell a parent should anyone try to touch them inappropriately. What if Mommy or Daddy is the abuser? she says. She prefers another video, in which off-limit areas are clearly demarcated, thus talking down to children, assuming they do not know their rear ends from their elbow.

Her video is not poorly done. But ours is better. Hers is but one more example of why children dislike school. It is one but more lecture from adults that assumes at the outset children have empty heads that they must fill. Ours, rather than lecturing, captures the imagination of the child. Having captured it, it drives the point home. "Even if it is someone you know or trust," Mommy warns.

The coup de grace, as far as I am concerned is that our video warns the child about ANYONE who would touch them innapropriately. Her video not only does not protect children in the event that the doctor is the abuser; it specifically says that it is okay for a doctor to touch private areas. Let us gather the 200 young women of the U.S Olympic team. Which video do they think would have protected them more?

I rather like the idea of Twitter, sort of a 'Fireside Chat for Dummies,' which is what most of us are. The only ones who might be upset over this will be the ones who a) don't like change, and b) are annoyed that they no longer have first access to his words in order to spin them.

For @JW Insider's sake, I will be very bold and predict that Trump will bring in socialized medicine, though it will not be called that. Even I do not think this likely, but most do not think it possible, so I still come off as being bold, though JTR will say insane.

Trump is pragmatic and has shown he is not bound by ideologies. I can't imagine how healthcare could work via competition among insurance companies when healthy persons can opt out. Obamacare, though it will surely crash of its own weight, has planted the notion, accepted everywhere else, that everyone deserves access to healthcare. Trump himself seems to embrace the idea. He may take the bull by the horns, figure he can craft a system that incorporates the private sector better than any Democrat can, for they distrust the private sector, and charge ahead.

It will be a very hard sell. He will lose many of his own people, but may gain from the other side. Even then it may be doomed. Americans are used to Cadillac treatment, and while universal health care is universal, its quality goes down. Pharma too, may scream, because they are used to soaking Americans to offset the modest profits they must take elsewhere. They will carry on about 'choking innovation,' and so forth. As it is, they don't bother innovating unless they see a substantial buck in it; that's why there is MRSA will no new antibiotics to fight it. It's hard to be optimistic here, but I can imagine Trump may try tackling it.

Maybe he can still sell it. Overall healthcare quality in America is well above that of any third world country. But among the developed countries, it comes in dead last. I'm tired of playing Russian Roulette with my modest net worth for every sliver I have removed. Perhaps other people are, too.

The funny thing about the thread that was removed is that the one justifiable cause for removing it was not there. One time that disgusting and ignorant hag of a Librarian reproved me, the old hen, for hawking my books, but I did not do it there that I can recall, though I might have a little. In fact, I do not do it anywhere, for I have come to realize it improper on a talk forum to plug my brilliantly written, zany but penetrating, doctrine-free (who cares about that stuff?) book about the faith which many brothers laugh out loud as they read it but some do not like it at all because it gives away many a fault like how you couldn’t get out in service on time because that pious character John Weedsnwheat kept rattling on and on and on about the daily text which I admit I never used to read because it is a bit-sized tidbit and I like something bigger but then one day I was assigned to conduct the reading of the text at the convention, and how I always wanted to jam with Prince, who is the subject of an entire chapter, but it was not to be in this system and will have to wait for the next because he was always busy and I – well, no – I would have found the time. It isn’t right to promote your book that way, though there are even worse things that will get you kicked off a thread and the entire thread hurled down with you, like the Chief Baddie was hurled into the abyss and all his baggage with him and so I never do it anymore, at least not too much, and oh and you know those plans you had for tonight? Cancel them so you can read my book, 30% preview of which is available for free and the remainder of which easily affordable and c’mon! you blow that much at Starbucks without the blinking of an eye.

JTR: That's completely the wrong way to do it, and you, a retired engineer, should know it.

You never eat the ears first, and while the base is permissible, it is not preferred. 

You always go first for the stomach.

Many Witnesses give the impression that they are trying hard to extend the length of their visit. I try to give the impression that I can’t get away quick enough.

This is especially useful when you feel locked into a paradigm of one of those full-sized plastic clowns for punching. You punch it and down it goes but because it is weighted at the bottom it immediately presents its smiling face for another punch. I try not to allow that to happen.

“Look, I don’t like you. Possibly, I could come to like you, but I don’t now. Let’s get this over with and see how it plays out.”

Of course, I don’t say this. In fact, I don’t even feel this way. I am friendly, but not at first over-sincere. Unfortunately, sincerity works well for civil people, but given the vicious disposition many display online, it is only to be expected that they will note your sincerity and take it as an invitation to smash you in the teeth with a baseball bat.

Go short, instead: “I’m Tom. I want to read you a scripture, see what you think of it, and I’m gone.” My experience is that I get to read it more often than I would with a more conventional approach. If they decline, I’m true to my word and leave. They frequently say: "No, but thank you for coming.”

When they say yes, I read them a scripture – you can choose whatever you want – and then: "I like this scripture because” and offer a sentence or two. It is now their turn, I point out. If you want to discuss or have questions or have observations or whatever, I can stay a bit. Otherwise, I move on.

If they seem agreeable, I’ll show them the video. “This runs almost four minutes, but you don’t have to watch it all. The minute it gets boring, hand it back.” They do hand it back sometimes. But not often.

Thank you, Russian brothers, for driving worldwide traffic to JW.org, where they will discover it is NOT extremist. What will be their response at that?

One kid I handed a Memorial invitation to but then I fudged. “The reason I am fudging,” I told him, “is that you are of the age where you are beginning to branch out and investigate different things but also of the age where your parents may think are still a child under their roof and they want to shield you from things. So I’m not sure if I should speak to you or not. What do you  think?”

Now it was his turn to fudge but he drew no line in the sand, so I said “tell you what. Here is a cool video, it runs a minute and a half, and I want you to give it back the instant if gets boring, and I will go away. Seriously. There is no pressure here.”

I played the video and he paid rapt attention at first, but then he gave it back, somewhat to my surprise. “We cool?” I asked him, and he said we were. As I walked down the sidewalk, I saw his Mom had just pulled in from shopping, which perhaps explains why he had given it back. I told her everything that had gone down, how he had handled talking to a stranger, and I concluded “so he handled himself real well. You should be proud of him.”

The worst you can ever do speaking to Jehovah’s Witnesses is to get stuck with a nut, and that does happen from time to time. But you will never get a liar. You will never get someone trying to do you harm financially or even stealing your identity or casing your house. Even for those who think we are ‘selling religion’ be assured that you cannot buy it on the spot even were we doing that. It is not a religion where you can ‘come down and be saved.’ You cannot become a Witness without completing a study of the Bible with them, seldom lasting less than a year in these parts, thus giving you endless opportunities to change your mind. Surely no one is so timid to run in terror at that. So conversing with Jehovah’s Witnesses is actually a ‘safe haven’ for learning to converse with strangers, and it is a free social service that we provide. If worse comes to worse and you get stuck with a nut, call me and I, who have been nicknamed the Antitypical Nut, will remove him for you.

16 hours ago, John Lindsay Barltrop said:

Where would you suggest............Hawaii!!!???

No. Gilligan's Island. After the Minnow's crew have been rescued. 

Say, when does that trial start up again? We're starting to get punchy

After the Russian trial & worldwide notice, separation of the sheep and goats will be less stressful than forming car groups!

55 minutes ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

If military men want to fight each other, I just wish they would do it in the middle of the Pacific Ocean.

Yes

"The event is coming up soon, so seats are half-price, which is not such a bargain as you may think, since they were free to begin with," and I hand them a Memorial invitation. 

You can't just say things willy-nilly. You must have a read on your householder and an concordant personality, but if you do, humor is a fine way to break tension.

"Listen, people are busy and I know you'll have things to do, so cancel them."

Inviting folks to the Memorial need not be complicated; in fact, you generally mess it up if you try to make it so.

"At this point, you have a choice. I can leave this instant and I am happy to do so. Or I have a cool video that explains how all this works in about a minute and a half. Or I can explain it myself, which will take two hours."

Most take the first option. Some take the second. incredibly, nobody has taken the third!

13 hours ago, JW Insider said:

This makes them feel "neutered" but not neutral.

This is very clever. I like it.

I like it when someone has looked beneath the surface, though it is at best a hobby, by no means necessary to the faith, and can be divisive when people push views. So I never do. And it seems you never do as well, or I would have known about it before now. Rarely do I mention this stuff among the friends and never to I press it. Other people disagree. No matter. The area king, the area media, and our own prior experiences all influence our current opinion, as does geography. What do brothers in the mid-East think?

Some of our people barely know such a thing as politics exist, and to the extent they were aware of it, were inclined to say of Trump: 'He's bombastic and I try to be polite.'

Though I can think of one PERSON who may not have reasoned that WAY, at least not while the FOUNDING FATHERS were using his facilities on a PIT STOP during their TIME TRAVELS!!!

1 hour ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

.

TTH ... just as you followed my trail to my Facebook account and found out I was dabbling in being a novelist ... you mentioned it, and I never have here ...I followed your trail to AVOID-JW.org, and actually COUNTED your postings.. I am a retired engineer,

 

If you retired as an engineer it is possibly because you cannot COUNT... At most, I POSTED three, and I think just two... Why in the WORLD would I LIE about such a thing? I actually begin to rethink that strategy. Not the strategy itself, but that particular site, which was just selected on a whim coming from somewhere ELSE!!! ...I mean, the title SAYS it all.... What I may SHOOT for is a SITE that purports to be a JW discussion forum but is ACTUALLY apostate dominated, this site being the exact opposite, with APOSTATES in the lesser role, UNLESS it is a sophisticated GOOD COP BAD COP apostate site, which in my deepest pits of despair I have sometimes WONDERED!!

If I followed any Facebook trail to DISCOVER ANY budding novelists, I did not deliberately do so with YOURS.... I DO someTIMES follow trails and maybe one of them is YOURS, but it so, it is coincidental. Once again, WHY WOULD I LIE about something so inconsequential???

22 hours ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

...and True TomHarley ... your 15 postings on the apostate web site AVOID-JW.ORG are as petulant and disjointed there as they are here.

.

 

Is that your site?

But you are incorrect. I have not made 15 postings - yet. The ones I have made are altogether different in tone. There, I am not impolite, for I in someone else's home. It is tentative that I remain there. I am not there to argue. If I am abused unreasonably there (for I am not one to take things personally, even when they are intended that way) I will leave. I have a whole circuit of actual people who like me. Less stressful to hang out with them, which I will do, in any event.

I don't know the lay of the land there, though the title certainly gives a clue. but there will be many there who have been out of the loop for a long time and will hate Jehovah's Witnesses for the wrong reason. Let me fill you in on the right reason, so that you will not look like an ass, I may tell them. Not all people are jerks who love to spout on without facts. Some people like to stay abreast on things, even matters concerning which they write about. It can be a win-win. But if I find that there are nothing but jerks there, I am gone in a twinkling.

While I am willing, for personal reasons, to disregard Theocratic direction on this subject, I am not willing to pretend it does not exist. I am being a bad boy. I am not trying to set an example for others to do the same. It may be unwise what I am doing. But every so often David says to Saul: "Look, I took out the bear. I kicked serious butt with that lion. I'm pretty sure I can take out that loudmouth jerk taunting the battle lines of the living God, if you will not flag me for abuse." When David says that, it is not presumptuous or immodest. This is particularly true if David is far older and the adversities of life have stuffed his head in the toilet a few times. Upon extracting it, he does not say: "I guess I showed that toilet a thing or two, didn't I?"

I will discontinue if things turn nasty there, but if they do, i will not have been the cause of it. There, as everywhere except the downed thread - say, was it you who complained about it? I mean, it clearly wasn't someone who has it in for apostates - I am nothing but joy and love. I could get called on this new course by my own people. If that happens, I will acquiesce, for we are not independent loose cannons. We are working under the leadership of one commander. It so happens that we have been so well trained that we can read his mind and venture to undertake missions without his prior consent, though I admit that borders upon presumptuousness. But if we find we are wrong and the commander says to stand down, I will do so instantly. 

For the longest time in the States, a Witness could be excused from jury duty simply by asking. But eventually everyone was ducking out, Witness or non-Witness, and the legal people said 'enough.' No excuses for anyone! Some of our people panicked, for they did not want themselves to be set up as judges over others in secular matters. Perceiving that a situaltion was getting out of hand, Davey-the-Kid volunteered for jury duty. He sat through the pre-trial negotiations. He approached the bench and told the judge: "I am one of Jehovah's Witnesses. It is my life; I would not be able to separate things learned there for the sake of things here. So far I do not see any conflict, but I want to make you aware of it. I do not want to be the bar thrust into the spokes of justice down the road."

That is not unparallel to my motive in this tentative role at ihatetheirguts.com. Perhaps I am a good one for it. I know our people inside and out, though I am not an insider, which almost makes it better. I have the advantage of being able to express myself better than many. This is not because I am smarter than they. It is because they have a life, and do not spend an absurd amount of time writing every day.

And I will not preface whatever I write there with:  You need to sit down, clear your minds, and CAREFULLY consider the next statement, which is ALWAYS true, whether one of Jehovah's Witnesses ... or in the world at large:

I am a person. Not everything I say is always true. Not always should people carefully consider what I have to say. Sometimes they should blow it off.

Trump bombed Syria and made a lot of people mad. How can you not make them mad when you’ve killed 15 people? He broke a lot of things, too, but he can always say: “Look, Vlad, what’s the big deal? I’m a billionaire. You’re a billionaire. But them some new planes out of your own pocket if it takes that to placate them.” The people are a different matter. But even that is mitigated by pointing out they were all (or almost all?) military people who have signed on to the program.

For some inexplicable reason, I feel I have a read on this guy. I long have. It surprises me to think so few do. Even that is hard to know for sure because in this scenario, as in all others, liars spin the facts this way and that for their own purposes. In the case of a President, the motivation to do so is high.

At any rate, his actions clearly turn a lot of memes on their head. Clearly, he is not a pawn of Putin, as U.S. media has insisted for months. Clearly, he does not hate Muslims, as they have also insisted. It is now spun that he is impulsive and acts from the heart. “Trump said he would not do Syria! No way! No how! Then he saw a picture,” I have heard.

Or perhaps it is all spin. The trouble with conspiracy theories is that, once a few of them prove to be true, you readily swallow the next one coming down the pipe. There are cabals hanging about and they do try to skew things. But these cabals have hated Trump from the beginning. I think it is because he is not one of them and they don’t feel able to control him. We all know that Trump is not a Republican. He took over the Republican party. It might just as well have been the Democratic party. He simply read the tea leaves and saw that, at the moment, the Republican party was easier to commandeer. When he says ‘drain the swamp,’ he is not referring to one party or the other.

Anyone in small business, which I have been, can easily conceive of a businessman who loves his country but thinks the slippery boobs have ruined it, saying: “There!  I built my business. Now let’s see if I can fix the country.” A BIG businessman can easily miss this because he is primarily worried about Trump’s effect on the stock market, but a small businessman doesn’t care, or at least it is not his chief concern. If you’re experience is something else entirely, you heard the ‘grab them by the you-know-what’ and concluded life around him was a 24/7 brothel. I always thought It was nonsense. I always agreed with him that it was ‘locker room’ talk. I did this because I have been in the locker room and they do not read Plato in there.

He can spin this as I believe it really is. There are some things so barbarous that you cannot go there. Chemical weapons are among them. They are not good, especially when you have just had photos of the victims thrust under your nose.  He did what he did impulsively, from the heart. Yet even that cannot be determined with certainty. Insiders said he leaned on and took options from the military people. He didn’t hastily tell them what to do. He let them tell him, and chose from the choices they presented.

It is easy to conclude that they, however are swayed by the business model. When BigDefence gets too big, it must keep the profits rolling in. If it does not, the stockholders will bolt for some noble competitor – say, BigPharma. So if the world threatens to get too peaceful, they must stir up the pot. It is the United States, not Russia, that is bombing many countries. It will never be fixed because money drives everything here. You solve nothing by taking out a bad guy. Another bad guy simply sees a fine new career opening. It is the play that must be changed, not the actors in the play, who simply follow the script given them – sometimes begrudginly, sometimes with gusto. Human reformers can change the actors, but they cannot change the play. Only God’s Kingdom will do that.

In a world where barbarities are commonplace, it is tough to know where to draw the line. “What’s one more slaughter in the greater scheme of things?” is easy to say. Is it preferred for Trump to say: “Ah, well – shit happens?” Obama drew a line in the sand and it was instantly crossed. Perhaps leaders should keep their mouths shut over such things, and not make grandiose remarks about slaughter being ‘unacceptable’ (duh) and how people will ‘be held accountable.’ They won’t be, usually. Why carry on as though they will, except so as not to look like a helpless fool. And don’t carry on about people being ‘cowardly.’ They may be despicable, but surely it is not cowardly to be willing to die for a cause – any cause, from Boy Scout to Barbarians-R-Us. Also, don’t whine on about how the terrorists are trying to change our way of life, but we won’t let that happen. If anything, they want us to maintain our way of life and thereby be easier targets to kill. And even the terrorists will say: “Look, they elect their leaders over there, and the leaders come over and kill all our loved ones. That makes them not so innocent after all.” Victims of massive suffering and evil, many turn into unreasoning animals that must be taken out, like putting down a vicious dog. But that doesn’t mean you must judge them for it; many in the West become unreasoning animals with far less provocation.

A man that recoils at the use of chemical weapons and reacts immediately can be spun as not such a bad thing. He can say to Putin: “Sorry. I lost it. but nothing has changed in the big picture. Let’s work together when it is expedient to fix the world.”

It’s not my cause. I am a neutral Jehovah’s Witness, interested in these things only as ‘current history.’ All human governments will drop the ball; the only question to be answered is upon which toe will if fall. The Kingdom arrangement, as detailed in the Bible, is the only permanent answer. So if you have read these words and said: “Harley is an idiot! I’ll write to tell him so,” please don’t. I will respond by saying: “you forgot to mention that I am also a moron.”

A brother commented on the pictures during a Watchtower study.

He said they portrayed a brother getting strong counsel from two elders, after which he pondered it, after which he met with one of those elders at the cafe (no hard feelings), after which he was busy in the ministry with the same elder!

But a sister saw it differently.

A brother was asking for spiritual help from two elders (maybe he was a chicken in field service), then he thought over their advice, then one of those elders encouraged him further at the cafe, then he was happily working in the ministry with that elder!

"These pictures are open to many interpretations," the study conductor observed.

His observation emboldened me to offer my take:

Brothers were meeting as a threesome as a gesture to the trinity, then one of them pondered that symbolism, then he met one of those elders at the cafe where they discussed this year's prospects for the eternally dismal Buffalo Bills, then he worked in service with that elder's twin brother, who had flown in the night prior from Boise, Idaho.

After my comment there was a pause.

For several minutes.

4 hours ago, Eoin Joyce said:

Fact is that humans have given their lives for all manner of causes, real and imagined, religious and secular, admired and condemned by others. 

During the Vietnam War period, Cassius Clay (Mohammed Ali) famously declared he would not go. "No Vietcong never called me nigger," [his words, not mine] he said. Exactly! If the kings of the earth couldn't get along, how did that become his problem?

People have fought and sometimes died for all manner of causes. it is not only Jehovah's Witnesses who refuse to let the good guys and the bad guys to be defined by the king.

Nonetheless, I begin to worry that the anal librarian will note with alarm that we are playing havoc with the Dewey Decimal System, eating of the off-topic fruit tree. She may separate this into a thread of its own, title it something like TrueTom vs the Patriots, and then take it down in alarm if that one actually begins pasting them. Better to return to the Russian trial, but - why, it is in recess!  Surely we can speak of other things waiting for it to reconvene.

Driving home, listening to the college station, all the songs and artists are unfamiliar to me. I was intrigued by one, singing lyrics she had written that didn’t quite work, yet she made them work through sheer intensity. Encountering a situation depressing,’ noting it makes a not good ‘impression’ doesn’t quite cut it, so when an artist successfully runs it through anyway, like a stauros through the eye of a needle, you respect her for it.

I would have called the DJs, carrying on as though stoned-out, and asked about it, but I didn’t have their number. I like, as I get older, stepping out of my comfort zone, seeking out persons I might normally not have much in common with. I even have done it here on the WorldMediaForum. Unfortunately, I have also tried to smash their kneecaps, but I have been helped to see the error of my ways. I am a writer, and I sometimes enjoy navigating dangerous shoals just to see if I can get away with it.

But if the brothers want me to ‘step out of my comfort zone,’ by – say, witnessing to swimmers on the beach, I tell them to take a hike. “I’m not even comfortable in my comfort zone,” I tell them.

6 hours ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

 

The reason YOU live in peace, is that such men have "stood on the wall", and "fought in the mud", and endured unspeakable horror, ... so that you can sleep warm in your beds at night.

As much as I admire JTR, I feel I must call him on this one.

At times in the ministry I will come across a Marine family, as is obvious by flags, stickers, stars, and slogans. I ask them their story. Perhaps they may look at me suspiciously. "I'm serious," I tell them, "I'm not trying to pick a fight; I'm not in the mood. It's obvious if you've fought for your country that you have a story to tell. Let's hear it."

Everyone has a story to tell but nobody wants to hear it. We are in the people business. If anyone deserves a listening ear, it is someone who has sacrificed for what they believe in. Essentially, that is among the reasons we ask them to give us a listening ear. We are not just on the internet trying to steal someone else's disciples; we are out there sacrificing, and that in and of itself suggests someone ought to give us a listening ear. Same with them.

The circumstances have to be right. I can't do it, or at least must scale back, if the car group is waiting. But I will hear them out as much as I am able to. It is disarming, for even their friends will not do it. 

I say one word for every ten of theirs. Perhaps I will observe toward the end how - isn't it strange how if I were a Marine myself, I would feel the same way about my country as they. Yet if I were a Marine in any other country, I would feel the same way about that country. Isn't it strange for the world to be carved up that way? Sometimes they find nothing strange about that at all, but sometimes they do.

Our happiness comes from our worship and service to God. It has little to do with the rule of the king we live under. Ask him what his ground rules are for maintaining public order, and then follow them. That is the pattern our brothers set around the world and they do not all wear long faces because they are not in the USA.

I would even argue with: "the reason YOU live in peace..." Do we? It's not Syria here, to be sure, but neither is is Shagnri-La.

I am here, and I like it here. But if I was there, I would like it there, especially if I was born there.

It's a valid point, David, I would not argue with it, even were I the type to argue over such things. (not implying that you are)