Brochure for inactive ones: Return to Jehovah

[HollyW]

I was going to post this in the Questions section, but then I thought it might become controversial.

What I found interesting about this brochure is its implication that inactive Jehovah's Witnesses can confess violating WTS rules for 40 years and not be disciplined for it, but rather will be welcomed back to each congregation with open arms.  The brochure tells of one coming back after 40 years of being inactive, who during that time had celebrated holidays, gone to other churches, been involved in politics, and probably much more. 

Has something been left out of the brochure....something like 'yes, you'll be welcomed back with open arms....as soon as the elders say you can be, but until them you'll be shunned for your 40 years of sins that you just confessed to them.' ?

I ask because the articles about inactive ones returning to the Kingdom Hall have always said something about  "Loving disciples may be required." There's even been instructions to those who may be asked to study with an inactive JW, such as this in a 2008 wt:

[w08 11/15 Help Them Return Without Delay!, p.12, par.2] If they assign a publisher to study with an inactive person desiring help, what should be done if the conductor learns that the individual has committed a serious sin? Instead of giving counsel about any judicial or confidential matter, the publisher should suggest that he speak to the elders. If he fails to do so, the publisher himself should inform the elders.

If elders can question the sincerity of someone's repentance because he or she waited a month or two before confessing it to the elders, wouldn't it be even more doubtful that a person confessing after 40 years is truly repentant?

 

Holly

 

[HollyW]

On 6/28/2016 at 10:40 AM, HollyW said:

I was going to post this in the Questions section, but then I thought it might become controversial.

What I found interesting about this brochure is its implication that inactive Jehovah's Witnesses can confess violating WTS rules for 40 years and not be disciplined for it, but rather will be welcomed back to each congregation with open arms.  The brochure tells of one coming back after 40 years of being inactive, who during that time had celebrated holidays, gone to other churches, been involved in politics, and probably much more. 

Has something been left out of the brochure....something like 'yes, you'll be welcomed back with open arms....as soon as the elders say you can be, but until then you'll be shunned for your 40 years of sins that you just confessed to them.' ?

I ask because the articles about inactive ones returning to the Kingdom Hall have always said something about  "Loving disciples may be required." There's even been instructions to those who may be asked to study with an inactive JW, such as this in a 2008 wt:

[w08 11/15 Help Them Return Without Delay!, p.12, par.2] If they assign a publisher to study with an inactive person desiring help, what should be done if the conductor learns that the individual has committed a serious sin? Instead of giving counsel about any judicial or confidential matter, the publisher should suggest that he speak to the elders. If he fails to do so, the publisher himself should inform the elders.

If elders can question the sincerity of someone's repentance because he or she waited a month or two before confessing it to the elders, wouldn't it be even more doubtful that a person confessing after 40 years is truly repentant?

 

Holly

 

Well, I know my post is being read....102 views....but so far there have been no replies about this important issue.  What if you are asked about it by the inactive ones with whom you've been placing the brochure, how would you answer them?  

 

[HollyW]

On another thread a question came up about authenticity and this brochure.  How many of you believe the experiences related in it are true?

This is Martha's experience, from the brochure:

Page 10: “My new job improved our family’s standard of living, but it also led me into all sorts of questionable activities. I began to celebrate holidays, to participate in political events, and even to attend church. I was inactive as one of Jehovah’s Witnesses for 40 years. The more time that went by, the more I thought I was beyond Jehovah’s forgiveness. I felt that I couldn’t forgive myself. After all, I knew the truth before I headed down the wrong path.”—Martha.

Page 11: That is what happened to Martha. She relates: “My son kept sending me the  Watchtower and Awake! magazines. Little by little, I became reacquainted with Jehovah. The hardest part of coming back was asking forgiveness for all the sins I had committed. But finally, I approached God in prayer and asked him to forgive me. It’s hard to believe that 40 years went by before I returned to Jehovah. I am living proof that even after many years, someone can be given another chance to serve God and be back in his love.”

Is it authentic or made up?

[Anna]

On 6/28/2016 at 1:40 PM, HollyW said:

I was going to post this in the Questions section, but then I thought it might become controversial.

What I found interesting about this brochure is its implication that inactive Jehovah's Witnesses can confess violating WTS rules for 40 years and not be disciplined for it, but rather will be welcomed back to each congregation with open arms.  The brochure tells of one coming back after 40 years of being inactive, who during that time had celebrated holidays, gone to other churches, been involved in politics, and probably much more. 

Has something been left out of the brochure....something like 'yes, you'll be welcomed back with open arms....as soon as the elders say you can be, but until them you'll be shunned for your 40 years of sins that you just confessed to them.' ?

I ask because the articles about inactive ones returning to the Kingdom Hall have always said something about  "Loving disciples may be required." There's even been instructions to those who may be asked to study with an inactive JW, such as this in a 2008 wt:

[w08 11/15 Help Them Return Without Delay!, p.12, par.2] If they assign a publisher to study with an inactive person desiring help, what should be done if the conductor learns that the individual has committed a serious sin? Instead of giving counsel about any judicial or confidential matter, the publisher should suggest that he speak to the elders. If he fails to do so, the publisher himself should inform the elders.

If elders can question the sincerity of someone's repentance because he or she waited a month or two before confessing it to the elders, wouldn't it be even more doubtful that a person confessing after 40 years is truly repentant?

 

Holly

 

One could also argue that on the contrary, after 40 years one could be MORE sure that the person is most likely repentant. Why else would they bother coming back if they have already done without it for so long?

I see you do not really understand the reasons behind disciplinary actions or why they are implemented. The primary reason is to GAIN our brother or sister. I know, it sounds odd, but the Bible always speaks about discipline in a positive light..."those whom Jehovah disciplines he loves" Do not forsake the discipline of your father/mother so that it may go well with you"  "Accept discipline in order to become wise in your future" "hold on to discipline....for it means your life" etc. etc.

Now looking at it from a logical perspective, what kind of discipline would this sister have benefited from? It was already too late for any discipline! The only thing she could have been is punished. And punishment is not what discipline is about. Remember discipline is positive. She had already been punished by the consequences of what she has done. Her conscience tortured her. That was punishment enough. Now the only way was up.

In contrast, someone who confesses a sin that happened only a few months ago, what kind of discipline would they benefit from? Remember discipline is a positive thing, helping someone to REGAIN their spiritual footing. The above mentioned sister had totally lost her footing, she had been on a totally different path (for 40 years). For her, she would have to start from scratch. Bible study etc. as if she was a newcomer. 

[HollyW]

 

On 10/13/2016 at 8:16 PM, Anna said:

One could also argue that on the contrary, after 40 years one could be MORE sure that the person is most likely repentant. Why else would they bother coming back if they have already done without it for so long?

I see you do not really understand the reasons behind disciplinary actions or why they are implemented. The primary reason is to GAIN our brother or sister. I know, it sounds odd, but the Bible always speaks about discipline in a positive light..."those whom Jehovah disciplines he loves" Do not forsake the discipline of your father/mother so that it may go well with you"  "Accept discipline in order to become wise in your future" "hold on to discipline....for it means your life" etc. etc.

Now looking at it from a logical perspective, what kind of discipline would this sister have benefited from? It was already too late for any discipline! The only thing she could have been is punished. And punishment is not what discipline is about. Remember discipline is positive. She had already been punished by the consequences of what she has done. Her conscience tortured her. That was punishment enough. Now the only way was up.

In contrast, someone who confesses a sin that happened only a few months ago, what kind of discipline would they benefit from? Remember discipline is a positive thing, helping someone to REGAIN their spiritual footing. The above mentioned sister had totally lost her footing, she had been on a totally different path (for 40 years). For her, she would have to start from scratch. Bible study etc. as if she was a newcomer. 

Hi Anna,

You're saying then that the brochure doesn't mention anything about being disciplined after 40 years of wrong doing because waiting that long shows they must be truly repentant.

Interesting.

[Anna]

17 hours ago, HollyW said:

 

Hi Anna,

You're saying then that the brochure doesn't mention anything about being disciplined after 40 years of wrong doing because waiting that long shows they must be truly repentant.

Interesting.

You totally misunderstood. That's not what I was saying. Of course she was not waiting 40 years to come back, I doubt she was waiting to come back at all, she was out, and for all intents and purposes was going to stay out permanently.  But this just goes to show that we should never judge anyone's situation, because something in the life of that woman changed, and against all odds she came back. If she wasn't truly repentant, wouldn't it have been easier for her to stay as she was?

[HollyW]

On 10/16/2016 at 8:27 PM, Anna said:

You totally misunderstood. That's not what I was saying. Of course she was not waiting 40 years to come back, I doubt she was waiting to come back at all, she was out, and for all intents and purposes was going to stay out permanently.  But this just goes to show that we should never judge anyone's situation, because something in the life of that woman changed, and against all odds she came back. If she wasn't truly repentant, wouldn't it have been easier for her to stay as she was?

Let's see.....returning to the WTS after 40 years of continued, deliberate, gross (to JWs) wrong-doing must mean true repentance to you, whereas one slip-up confessed a couple months later (without ever becoming inactive) makes that JWs' true repentance questionable.  If you were the latter JW and were lovingly disfellowshipped and endearingly shunned by your fellow JWs while working toward being reinstated, while Martha returns after 40 years of debauchery and is welcomed back with open arms (and is required to shun YOU), you're okay with that because you believe the men who decide these things must have Jehovah's ear on the matter and that's why they left out any mention of discipline for inactive JWs who return to the WTS.

[Anna]

10 hours ago, HollyW said:

Let's see.....returning to the WTS after 40 years of continued, deliberate, gross (to JWs) wrong-doing must mean true repentance to you, whereas one slip-up confessed a couple months later (without ever becoming inactive) makes that JWs' true repentance questionable.  If you were the latter JW and were lovingly disfellowshipped and endearingly shunned by your fellow JWs while working toward being reinstated, while Martha returns after 40 years of debauchery and is welcomed back with open arms (and is required to shun YOU), you're okay with that because you believe the men who decide these things must have Jehovah's ear on the matter and that's why they left out any mention of discipline for inactive JWs who return to the WTS.

It seems like you are still not understanding the idea really. Do you not think that after a while, one becomes desensitized and no longer believes the JWs even have the truth, or at least push that idea to the furthermost crevices of their brain? It says she was wracked with guilt. I very much doubt she lived all of the 40 years like that though.The short paragraph doesn't go into any real detail, so we do not know whether what she did after a while was still deliberate in her mind. From the way you are speaking, "gross wrong doing to JWs", indicates that you do not consider the things she did wrong. So put yourself in her shoes, I doubt she considered them wrong after a while either. So, from that perspective, when she decided to come back, it was as if she had never knew the "truth". What would be the point of punishing someone like that? Tell me.

Men who decide these things go by common sense and evidence presented to them. That's all they can go by really.

[HollyW]

6 hours ago, Anna said:

It seems like you are still not understanding the idea really. Do you not think that after a while, one becomes desensitized and no longer believes the JWs even have the truth, or at least push that idea to the furthermost crevices of their brain? It says she was wracked with guilt. I very much doubt she lived all of the 40 years like that though.The short paragraph doesn't go into any real detail, so we do not know whether what she did after a while was still deliberate in her mind. From the way you are speaking, "gross wrong doing to JWs", indicates that you do not consider the things she did wrong. So put yourself in her shoes, I doubt she considered them wrong after a while either. So, from that perspective, when she decided to come back, it was as if she had never knew the "truth". What would be the point of punishing someone like that? Tell me.

Men who decide these things go by common sense and evidence presented to them. That's all they can go by really.

From what you've been saying in answer to why the brochure has left out any mention of discipline for inactive JWs who return to the WTS, I would conclude that it was because that's exactly the point the governing body wants to convey---an amnesty, or indulgence, even if you've been going against WTS teachings for 40 years.

Martha mentions only three things specifically: celebrating holidays, participating in political events, and attending church.  As far as I know, JWs are the only ones who consider those things to be wrong, hence my statement "gross (to JWs) wrong-doing".

[Anna]

On 10/23/2016 at 5:56 AM, HollyW said:

From what you've been saying in answer to why the brochure has left out any mention of discipline for inactive JWs who return to the WTS, I would conclude that it was because that's exactly the point the governing body wants to convey---an amnesty, or indulgence, even if you've been going against WTS teachings for 40 years.

Whatever they might be trying to covey, one thing is clear, whether someone has been gone for 1 year or 40 years, and they want to come back, they will be welcomed. Varying circumstances call for varying measures, but in the end the welcome will be the same.