BETHEL'S BIG SECRET

[Patiently waiting for Truth]

On 2/15/2022 at 5:30 PM, Pudgy said:

Sometimes, excellent practical results can be obtained from information that is completely false.

What might seem excellent in the eyes of man, may not be so in the eyes of God. 

[Pudgy]

I seriously doubt that Jehovah God has any opinions at all about how we do, or do not, calculate celestial navigation to be able to cross the oceans safely, and even nowadays use GPS. in our cars.

[Srecko Sostar]

17 hours ago, Dmitar said:

Another mistake you made, thinking Pastor Russell wasn't called ELDER.

Sorry, on what basis did you come to the conclusion that I mean this or that around the name "elder" and Russell? Virtually all JW literature calls Russell a "pastor." If they call him "elder" somewhere, I don't mind, but I don't know. Maybe you have the proper link to a WTJWorg publication that shows and proves.

Mistake from me? Not for now. I just conclude based on what I know. And that never can be wrong. hahahhahaha (Translation: joke, for those who don't understand my humorous expressions)

[Srecko Sostar]

19 hours ago, Dmitar said:

The Jehovah's Witnesses headquarters runs under a different schism now.

I would love to read more about this, from you.

[Srecko Sostar]

18 hours ago, Space Merchant said:

You're the former Jehovah's Witness, do not tell me suddenly your faith opponents is now above you

How my former fellow believers feel about me is their problem. It's not mine, and I don't think it's your concern either, is it? Or you still care, given the comment you made.

What is your need to find out how JW feels about me? Well, if you’re interested, please read their publications and listen to what they say about former members, so you’ll know how they feel and what they think about ex-JW. Satisfied?

I have no inferiority complex, so to think that JWs are better than other people, ex-JW or me. :))))

18 hours ago, Space Merchant said:

I do not lead institutions nor do I think of doing so. 

Good for you, even better for others. 

But by the way. Do you act like a "pastor" with respect to the people around you?

[Dmitar]

1 hour ago, Srecko Sostar said:

Sorry, on what basis did you come to the conclusion that I mean this or that around the name "elder" and Russell? Virtually all JW literature calls Russell a "pastor." If they call him "elder" somewhere, I don't mind, but I don't know. Maybe you have the proper link to a WTJWorg publication that shows and proves.

On the basis of the Bible Student literature I just provided as proof. Therefore, your conclusion is wrong.

1 hour ago, Srecko Sostar said:

Mistake from me? Not for now. I just conclude based on what I know.

Sad to say, when it comes to the Bible Student History, you are among many here that don't know that history very well. That's why using articles from that era is moot, and it becomes nonsense, since it reflects on what you just proved, "I just conclude based on what I know."

1 hour ago, Srecko Sostar said:

I would love to read more about this, from you.

I don't have to explain something, you should have been aware of when you became a Jehovah's Witness. Just because you are NO longer a Jehovah's Witness, that hasn't changed.

1 hour ago, Srecko Sostar said:

How my former fellow believers feel about me is their problem. It's not mine, and I don't think it's your concern either, is it? Or you still care, given the comment you made.

I have to ask, why are you here, then?

1 hour ago, Srecko Sostar said:

What is your need to find out how JW feels about me? Well, if you’re interested, please read their publications and listen to what they say about former members, so you’ll know how they feel and what they think about ex-JW. Satisfied?

You seem to indicate this is something not supported by scripture. Have you read the portions that do relate to your kind?

 

[Srecko Sostar]

1 hour ago, Dmitar said:

On the basis of the Bible Student literature I just provided as proof. Therefore, your conclusion is wrong.

I think opposite, how your conclusion (about me) is wrong. But as i said, i am fine with your claim how BS titled Russell with "elder" too.

2 hours ago, Dmitar said:

Sad to say, when it comes to the Bible Student History, you are among many here that don't know that history very well. That's why using articles from that era is moot, and it becomes nonsense, since it reflects on what you just proved, "I just conclude based on what I know."

If we start from the fact that I put an excerpt from the official JWorg site that confirms why BS called Russell a “Pastor,” then this statement of yours goes in the direction; that the official WTJWorg publication makes a false statement, that it deceives its readers. Also, that readers of WTJWorg publications cannot find out the exact historical facts, because better connoisseurs of history, like you, claim that readers of WTJWorg publications (JW and ex-JW and others) will not be able to understand what is true and what is not without correction of people like you .
This may, of course, be somewhat true, as WTJWorg literature tends to skip historical facts or misrepresent them or, like you in this case, claim that readers misunderstand the text read.
All of this could mean that someone in WTJWorg is engaging in intrigue while writing “spiritual food”. Or that you are engaged in manipulations. Either way, many of you don’t seem to be trusted.

2 hours ago, Dmitar said:

I have to ask, why are you here, then?

Good question. :)) I will let you know when i find answer.

2 hours ago, Dmitar said:

You seem to indicate this is something not supported by scripture. Have you read the portions that do relate to your kind?

According to your opinion (or their opinion) , what is "my kind"? 

Although your words are “dry letters” on internet paper, I feel a negative vibration through the monitor screen. :))

[Dmitar]

2 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

I think opposite, how your conclusion (about me) is wrong. But as i said, i am fine with your claim how BS titled Russell with "elder" too.

When it's there in print for everyone to see, there's only one conclusion. That, you don't accept it or have @JW Insider to correct you, just like he "demands" it of me to correct certain wordings that he doesn't otherwise demand that of former Jehovah's Witnesses, is something you should correct yourself. 

However, my assertion runs more to the inaccurate Bible Student History, people here seem not to get very well, with that, you included.

2 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

If we start from the fact that I put an excerpt from the official JWorg site that confirms why BS called Russell a “Pastor,” then this statement of yours goes in the direction; that the official WTJWorg publication makes a false statement, that it deceives its readers.

That's not in dispute. I believe the title was in question. Unless you don't understand your own post, that's what I was referring to. Pastor Russell was also called an Elder. 

2 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

Also, that readers of WTJWorg publications cannot find out the exact historical facts, because better connoisseurs of history, like you, claim that readers of WTJWorg publications (JW and ex-JW and others) will not be able to understand what is true and what is not without correction of people like you .

They can always "ask" a Bible Student about their history. However, There are certain "factions" within the Bible Student Association that have a difference of opinion on what that history is. Therefore, caution should be exercised. Certainly, nothing written here, comes close to accuracy.

2 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

This may, of course, be somewhat true, as WTJWorg literature tends to skip historical facts or misrepresent them or, like you in this case, claim that readers misunderstand the text read.
All of this could mean that someone in WTJWorg is engaging in intrigue while writing “spiritual food”. Or that you are engaged in manipulations. Either way, many of you don’t seem to be trusted.

There are certain things that Pastor Russell can be accredited for. However, had he been alive when Jehovah's Witnesses were formed, he wouldn't have agreed with that change in theology. Therefore, the only manipulation of literature comes from disgruntled past and present Jehovah's Witnesses with a dark agenda to cause confusion.

2 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

Good question. :)) I will let you know when i find answer.

It's not that difficult to determine unless you're saying, you're not in control of your mind. Is that the case?

2 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

According to your opinion (or their opinion) , what is "my kind"? 

Although your words are “dry letters” on internet paper, I feel a negative vibration through the monitor screen. :))

Those that have chosen to walk away from the light to embrace the dark side. Do you want me to show you the many Bible based standards given for your kind?

I'll leave you with a Proverbs version as an example from the many.

NIV Prov 24:1-2

1 Do not envy wicked men, do not desire their company; 2 for their hearts plot violence, and their lips talk about making trouble.

 

[Witness]

9 hours ago, Dmitar said:

Those that have chosen to walk away from the light to embrace the dark side.

Light.  

"Every good and perfect gift is from above, coming down from the Father of the heavenly lights, who does not change like shifting shadows."  James 1:17

Light from God is wisdom.  It is a gift we receive through Jesus Christ, when we sincerely ask in faith.  

“So I say to you, ask, and it will be given to you; seek, and you will find; knock, and it will be opened to you. 10 For everyone who asks receives, and he who seeks finds, and to him who knocks it will be opened. 11 If a son asks for bread from any father among you, will he give him a stone? Or if he asks for a fish, will he give him a serpent instead of a fish? 12 Or if he asks for an egg, will he offer him a scorpion? 13 If you then, being evil, know how to give good gifts to your children, how much more will your heavenly Father give the Holy Spirit to those who ask Him!”  Luke 11:9-13

Wisdom is a gift from God that we receive when we search for it, when we ask for it.   This light of wisdom and truth in Jesus Christ, never grows dim, and never goes out.  

John 8:12 - "Then Jesus spoke to them again, saying, “I am the light of the world. He who follows Me shall not walk in darkness, but have the light of life.”

This can't found where teachings are discarded for other teachings...that are also discarded. Were these teachings of Wt, that no longer are taught, ever  gifts from God and Jesus?  Not according to the inspired words above. Wt. leaders consistently give their followers stones and serpents, instead of bread and fish - spiritual food for nourishment.    Surely, some JW here must agree that "old light" never again referred to, cannot be considered a "gift" from God, but instead, originates in the folly of men.  These decrepit teachings die out and rot.  Matt 7:15-20

Eccl 2:13 - "I realized that wisdom has an advantage over folly, just as light has an advantage over darkness."

Anyone who reaches this realization, and leaves the Wt. to follow Jesus Christ, has chosen to walk away from darkness, and embrace the light of Christ.  

"The light of the righteous will rejoice, but the lamp of the wicked will die out."   Prov 13:9

 

 

 

 

 

[JW Insider]

Dmitar, I just sent the following to you as a private message, but it would not go through, so I am copying it verbatim from the private messages section over to here:

---------------------------------------------------

On 2/16/2022 at 3:07 PM, Dmitar said:

...Another mistake you made, thinking Pastor Russell wasn't called ELDER.

1H175
but that they may have a third, or a fourth chance, and on without limit? Can Elder Russell tell? ...

Therefore, that argument about titles, is moot.

I'm sorry that I haven't been paying much attention to the conversation that included the comments I just requoted above. I have glanced at the topic now and then, mostly because of all the times you have made a reference to me. Just to let you know that I have never had a private conversation with Srecko about any topic, and neither has Srecko ever tried to initiate a conversation with me.

On the point you made above, I agree that it doesn't seem to make any difference whether Russell had ever been addressed with the title "Elder." I'm sure that the instance you noted above was not the only one. And I'm not sure what Srecko's point was about thinking that Pastor Russell was not called "Elder." I didn't go back into the conversation to find out.

In any case, you might want to point out to Srecko that the evidence you made use of was not from a fellow Bible Student, but from someone who opposed Russell on nearly every major doctrinal point. It was from the Russell-White debate, as I'm pretty sure you were already aware. It was from someone who would not have recognized Russell as "Pastor" in any case. This was not the only instance of Mr. White referring to Elder Russell in that debate, of course. But wouldn't it make more sense to have found an instance of a fellow Bible Student referring to Russell with the title "Elder"?

Thanks,

JWI

[Dmitar]

4 hours ago, Witness said:

This can't found where teachings are discarded for other teachings...that are also discarded. Were these teachings of Wt, that no longer are taught, ever  gifts from God and Jesus?  Not according to the inspired words above. Wt. leaders consistently give their followers stones and serpents, instead of bread and fish - spiritual food for nourishment.

Unfortunately, this argument is moot coming from a none compliant former Jehovah's Witness. You're not helping your own Christianity. What teaching are you offering visitors here  aside from rotten bread and fish? What kind of gift do you believe God has bestowed upon those who speak evil of others?

NCV Mark 7:20-23

20 And Jesus said, "The things that come out of people are the things that make them unclean. 21 All these evil things begin inside people, in the mind: evil thoughts, sexual sins, stealing, murder, adultery, 22 greed, evil actions, lying, doing sinful things, jealousy, speaking evil of others, pride, and foolish living. 23 All these evil things come from inside and make people unclean."

Therefore, you nor anyone here is in a position to judge, with God's authority, regardless if they are former or present members.

4 hours ago, Witness said:

Anyone who reaches this realization, and leaves the Wt. to follow Jesus Christ, has chosen to walk away from darkness, and embrace the light of Christ.  

This would depend on the true nature and motive. A none repentant soul has no such luxury.

NIV 2 Peter 2:20-22

20 If they have escaped the corruption of the world by knowing our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ and are again entangled in it and overcome, they are worse off at the end than they were at the beginning. 21 It would have been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than to have known it and then to turn their backs on the sacred command that was passed on to them. 22 Of them the proverbs are true: "A dog returns to its vomit," and, "A sow that is washed goes back to her wallowing in the mud."

[Space Merchant]

22 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

How my former fellow believers feel about me is their problem.

The issue is the fact you were formerly a Jehovah's Witness, yet, you lack even the basic things of your former faith. You do not even know who was the second leader of the Bible Students; for you did this here to not look foolish, but the reality is, your remarks elsewhere proves you are pushing an Agenda based lie just to save face.

• As seen here # 1
• Here # 2
• JWI even provided some information in which you interacted with him on that.

That is Hypocritical.

Everyone, both current, former, as with those who study Religion is aware that Rutherford took over for Russell - case closed.

23 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

Or you still care, given the comment you made.

It is not about care, as with I don't care at all, this it is more so as to exposed, which you walked into that remark on your own when you attested to the remark about religious leaders. You engineered this yourself. Going back to Examples 1, 2 and 3, they are alluded to Rutherford, especially Example 1 because of the events of Tulsa whereas around the time Black Wall Street was getting destroyed, as with blood running in the streets from the violence, you can see convention pictures of Rutherford in old pictures.

Example below which is near a court house, a picture of Rutherford can be seen in the background whereas their was a conflict between White and Black people taking place; events of Tulsa 1921.

Current and former JWs are aware of Pastor Rutherford's conventions, as is his lead of the Bible Students, after all, even in this forum you made remarks of the book which relates to Example 3, but here we see you are pretending to not be aware.

23 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

What is your need to find out how JW feels about me?

This has to do with you.

Your former faith, as with former members of the faith is aware of who led the Bible Students, the first being Russell. Therefore the fact you play ignorant here but elsewhere you attest to the notation shows you to be a lair, cowardice to your own claim at best.

23 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

Well, if you’re interested, please read their publications and listen to what they say about former members, so you’ll know how they feel and what they think about ex-JW. Satisfied?

Rutherford took over for the Bible Students, we all know.

I do not see why you were so afraid to say it.

23 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

I have no inferiority complex, so to think that JWs are better than other people, ex-JW or me. :))))

Technically you do.

I can pull some of your remarks about Example 3 elsewhere, as with other notations to Rutherford vs here when you claim ignorance to pretend you have no idea of who lead the Bible Students. As is you not knowing as to why your forerunner was called a Judge.

23 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

Good for you, even better for others. 

Learn your history, you need it, for anyone attempting to re-write history or deny events of the Holocaust, it is problematic, as is agreeing with those who hold such an idea - hence Agenda. You make the Black Hebrew Israelites look like saints, in this regard for they attempted the same thing many times, and people like me refute them as well.

23 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

But by the way. Do you act like a "pastor" with respect to the people around you?

I am a Preacher of the Word, nothing more. As Preachers, we call out the accursed, as with falsehoods and false witnesses, which is called a Refutation. - Galatians 1:1-11. As side for that, anyone that repaints history because of an Agenda, I tend to call that out too.

That being said, it does not matter if you agree or disagree with JWs, even for the fact you were formerly one, an Ex-Deacon of the faith, but at the same time, you should not be this gullible to false witnesses and adhere to it as a truth, it not only makes you look bad, but shows the lack of thinking in regards to historical accounts. Some EXJWs usually go after Jehovah's Witnesses stating they lack critically thinking, likewise with Atheist who says this of all Christians. You should at least shed some responsibility to research anything and everything, even videos such as this, the fact you play the role of a White Knight for someone tainted in this field, only causes more harm, than good, on your part.

As stated before, the video is misleading, and the facts proved this to be the case, facts are everything.