Division within the watch tower world.

[John 12.24to28]

13 minutes ago, Pudgy said:

Before they moved, there used to be a glass cabinet full of “Telly” awards that the Society bought and gave to themselves for excellence in video productions of various sorts. They looked sorta like Oscars, gold and shiny, on a pedestal.

sorta like what Boyle mentioned, above.

 

I remember seeing them on a tour. Brother Semonian was there and he told us about them.

[John 12.24to28]

11 minutes ago, boyle said:

Does this mean you believe those that have subjected themselves to a figurative hell, God loves them?

 

Yes. It's very clear that He does love them.

 

12 minutes ago, boyle said:

Do you think Jehovah loves Satan and what he did to humanity?

 

No. The angel that became Satan is already dead. He has been dead a long time. By dead I mean he's gone past the point of being able to be revived. "They are not his children, the defect is their own." 

The rest of humanity still has a chance to repent and turn around, so Jehovah can love them because of the absolute value of the ransom blood. 

 

14 minutes ago, boyle said:

Is that the point, or is it what God did to Solomon? Have you read 1 Kings 11?

 

Jehovah was mad at Solomon because Solomon stopped protecting the people. Solomon introduced practices that hurt the people. Jehovah didn't stop loving Solomon. Jehovah hated the bad things Solomon did because they hurt him and others. Jehovah didn't hate the man.

 

It's the same with the leaders in the organization. And with the sheep that are in all those other sects. He doesn't hate them. He's mad that they do dumb things because He doesn't like seeing people get hurt, but He doesn't hate the people. He's Jehovah. They're His kids.

[John 12.24to28]

1 hour ago, Pudgy said:

The shepherds of biblical times used to tenderly care for their sheep, because internet blogging had not been invented, and they were bored sitting around the house all day playing with their dradels.

There is an unsubstantiated rumor that from time to time they would cut their fur off, and kill them, and burn them in FIRE, and EAT them!

 

(Not everybody eats their domestics.)

 

"And I have other sheep, which are not of this fold; those too I must bring in, and they will listen to my voice, and they will become one flock, one shepherd."

 

"Now all the tax collectors and the sinners kept gathering around him to hear him.  And both the Pharisees and the scribes kept muttering: “This man welcomes sinners and eats with them.”  Then he told them this illustration, saying:  “What man among you with 100 sheep, on losing one of them, will not leave the 99 behind in the wilderness and go after the lost one until he finds it?  And when he has found it, he puts it on his shoulders and rejoices.  And when he gets home, he calls his friends and his neighbors together, saying to them, ‘Rejoice with me, for I have found my sheep that was lost.’  I tell you that in the same way, there will be more joy in heaven over one sinner who repents than over 99 righteous ones who have no need of repentance."

 

When one of the domestics gets out (or gets chased out by a predator), you go get them back, even if you have to fight off the predator. There's no question about it.

 

Jesus is coming to remove the wolves and gather in all the sheep. Wherever they are. Praise Jehovah.

 

"How much more valuable is a man than a sheep!"

IMG_2588.mov

[John 12.24to28]

5 minutes ago, boyle said:

In your mind, an addict, drunkard, adulterer, fornicator, etc. should not be punished because you want to add your personal emotion to the bible?

 

Most addicts are trying to cope with pain.

 

Did you ever notice that Jesus healed and fed people before he taught them?

 

He set the pattern. That is the preview. Jesus isn't going to just execute everybody before they even have a chance to learn about the truth. How can they learn about the truth in this world? There is too much pain.

 

Jehovah is not an unreasonable tyrant. He is a Real Father and a Real Shepherd and a Real Teacher. He will make sure the little ones have a chance to taste goodness before they are taught and then they can make a choice. He's not just going to execute all the little ignorant ones at Armageddon. And He most certainly is not going to execute truth-seekers who are just digging in the wrong place.

 

 

[John 12.24to28]

2 minutes ago, boyle said:

Do you personally see Jesus every day to ask him to heal the sick and afflicted?

 

I ask Jehovah every day to help heal and comfort the spiritually sick and spiritually afflicted, like you. I ask Him in Jesus name. I "see" him answer those kinds of prayers all the time (in a figurative way of course.) Some of those things take a long time, so we have to be patient.

 

4 minutes ago, boyle said:

I notice how Jesus left instructions to obey God's word, which includes rebuke.

 

I don't know if you've noticed but I rebuke you all the time. 🤪

[John 12.24to28]

5 hours ago, Matthew9969 said:

Found this interesting read....Who are the True Faith Jehovah’s Witnesses? Why did they break away from Bethel? « Beyond the Watchtower (beyondwatchtower.com)

 

This thread is called "Division within the watch tower world"...Jesus foretold there would be such divisions. He gave instructions to the angels of the congregations as recorded in Revelation. ("The stars mean the angels of the congregations." Angels are angels, angels here doesn't mean humans. Angels means angels.)

 

The Son of man will send out his angels to repair the divisions in the congregations at the appointed time. 

 

Jehovah is sometimes called "Jehovah of Armies". He has many different armies.

 

Have you ever seen an army of crows go after a hawk? Can you imagine an army of angels going after a wolf?

 

IMG_4063.mov  

 

 

"There is strong confidence in the fear of Jehovah, 

And it will be a refuge for his children."

 

"For your confidence to be in Jehovah, 

I am giving you knowledge today."

 

Jesus will send out his angels to remove the wolves and to gather back the ones who have gone beyond the watchtower.

 

"God is not a mere man who tells lies,

Nor a son of man who changes his mind.  

When he says something, will he not do it?

When he speaks, will he not carry it out?"

 

Praise Jehovah of armies.💖

[Matthew9969]

3 hours ago, Pudgy said:

Yeah!

An unexplained down vote is like a chicken in a vacuum.

 

At least the chickens don't have to be dipped in hot wax water to remove the feathers.

[Matthew9969]

So I guess we can't trust the current jw's in being the one true religion since there are splinter jw's with their own version of the one true religion. It's almost like which version of the chocolate cookie is the best version since the original recipe came out!!!! Which version of the chocolate cookie is the current jw's?

[John 12.24to28]

2 hours ago, Matthew9969 said:

So I guess we can't trust the current jw's in being the one true religion since there are splinter jw's with their own version of the one true religion. It's almost like which version of the chocolate cookie is the best version since the original recipe came out!!!! Which version of the chocolate cookie is the current jw's?

 

Jesus said the congregations would be a mess. "Hold fast what you have until I come," he said. Most sheep do not think really deeply. That there would be a congregation is obvious from the scriptures. Jesus will fix it when he gets here. Jehovah's left His name on Jehovah's Witnesses. While they are messed up on many things, if you think from a practical point of view, it would be easier for Jesus to come fix up that organization and bring everyone together there than to just start over. Jesus' name means "Jehovah Is Salvation" and regardless of how you want to pronounce it, Jehovah's name means "He Causes To Become". If He can cause the dead to be raised and if He can heal the sick, then He can cause a messed up organization to become healed and alive in love and truth.

[John 12.24to28]

Regardless of the business corporation parts or of the apparent "leaders" (be it Russell, Rutherford, Knorr or whoever) the facts are that there are a bunch of people organized into congregations all over the world who already believe the Bible is God's Word, they already believe that Jehovah is God's name, and they already believe some of the basic teachings from the Bible. They've got boots-on-the-ground, so-to-speak. 

 

When Jesus made food for everybody, he didn't make fancy focaccia bread or exquisitely prepared makimono and uramaki sushi rolls - he used what was on hand, some plain fish and plain bread. 

 

The basic parts of the organization are sufficient for Jesus to use to do a miracle. "You go with the army you have." Jesus can make up the difference.

 

When the Hebrews were facing the Red Sea and Pharoah's army was coming down on them, Jehovah did the unexpected. When Lazarus had been dead for four days and starting to stink, Jesus did the unexpected. For those who know the details of the rot and spiritual death in parts of the organization, it would be extremely unexpected that the organization could be used. Which is exactly why we can have confidence that Jehovah will act. His Name is There. He does the unexpected for a purpose. He will act for His Name's Sake and for the sake of His loyal ones. He will get glory for himself by doing the unexpected. He will bring back all the sheep and they will rejoice. It's as good as done. "He is a God, not of the dead, but of the living, for they are all living to him.” Praise Jehovah.

[John 12.24to28]

33 minutes ago, boyle said:

Jehovah will react to true worshipers, not those that confuse his words.

 

When Jehovah saved the Hebrews and a vast mixed crowd of Egyptians out of Egypt, some those people confused His words. 

 

(Who was the one who made that golden calf anyway?)

 

And yet, Aaron became installed as priest. Go figure.

 

Jehovah forgives. Even confused people. The ransom is enough for them. Praise Jehovah.

[John 12.24to28]

15 minutes ago, boyle said:

Yes, Jehovah forgives repented confused people. The unrepentant, receive judgment.

 

And we don't have to decide who is repentant and who is not. We don't have to judge who is a true worshipper and who is not based on outward appearances or any human checklist. Jesus is appointed to do the judging.

 

3 hours ago, Matthew9969 said:

which version of the chocolate cookie is the best version

 

I love chocolate chip cookies. It doesn't matter to me if they have walnuts or not, if they are double chocolate or if you use Toll House brand morsels. I just love chocolate chip cookies.

 

Do you think Jehovah loves chocolate chip cookies?

 

When He visited Abraham, He ate a meal with him. (I don't think they had chocolate chip cookies back then, but if they did, surely Jehovah would enjoy one.)

 

Jehovah loved Abraham. God's Word says Abraham is God's friend.

 

"O our God, did you not drive away the inhabitants of this land from before your people Israel and then give it as a lasting possession to the offspring of your friend Abraham?"

 

"But you, O Israel, are my servant, You, O Jacob, whom I have chosen, The offspring of Abraham my friend..."

 

"You see that his faith was active along with his works and his faith was perfected by his works,  and the scripture was fulfilled that says: “Abraham put faith in Jehovah, and it was counted to him as righteousness,” and he came to be called Jehovah’s friend."

 

Abraham was Jehovah's friend before there was "an organization". Abraham was Jehovah's friend before there was a Bible. Abraham was Jehovah's friend before Abraham was circumcised, before he was in a covenant, before he was baptized. (He never was baptized actually! Shocking!)

 

If Jehovah can be friends with someone before they are baptized, then how much more so He can be friends with sincere people in the different "sects" who are doing their best to read God's Word every single day! "Jehovah knows those who belong to him." 

 

Jehovah is not complicated. "God is love." He loves them too.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LfF3DJQs_G0